I went to a highscool where there were about 20-30 International Baccalaureate Diploma candidates and about 1200 students in regular, honors, and a handful of AP classes. My junior and senior year I was in all IB classes, but freshman and junior year I had to take a handful of the regular, honors, and an AP class and they were all absurdly slow and easy to be successful in to the point that I would entirely disengage. Had I not been in such a rigorous program I think I would have almost certainly made worse choices in relation to my education and life outside of school.
Perfect! Make sure you speak up so the AI can understand you and Amazon doesn't have to hire more poorly treated minimum wage employees to listen and figure out what you're saying
There's good software to extract voice from audio though! One time I had this webpage [0] open, forgot about it, until a colleague started a phone conversation from the other side of the open space, my laptop's mic picked it up and I got his sharp voice in my headphones.
Amazon doesn't use minimum wage employees for that, they use "contractors" and if they get them overseas they don't even have to pay them minimum wage!
I agree with you on the point you're getting at. Really anything that can be potentially logged due to a bug or accessed by a human may as well be considered the same as perpetual, in my opinion.
The difference is I trust Apple enough to turn off Siri on my phone and feel safe nothing is being broadcast online or stored locally for another app to access.
Is this guaranteed? Hell no. I also don't read the source code of every open source program I use (and even if I do I'm aware people exist much smarter than me who can obfuscate their malicious code).
Apple's business strategy, their history of actions, and their security system make me feel confident enough in _assuming_ my voice never reaches their servers and cannot be turned in by an app without explicit permissions. That last bit is also important. Like the Android Facebook background audio "bug", even if it is really a bug, to me it's no different.
Lastly even if Amazon were trustworthy about not listening when they say and not accessing voice data they shouldn't, I don't trust the platform very much. Quick idea, can you create a multi-turn alexa skill that after the first turn pretends Alexa is finished but it is actually actively recording and waiting to fake a response to "Alexa! <do other skill>"? Personally I don't know, don't have the source to check, and I wouldn't really believe any amazon engineer coming in here and saying "It's impossible to exploit". (Even if my 5 minute idea is impossible multiply that times thousands of malicious people spending much longer trying to exploit it)
edit: Don't mean to imply an Apple is impossible to hack or exploit. Just that they take a more active stance and have the history to back it up.
> But once I saw how smartphones were being designed as surveillance devices, I refused to play.
Get a FOSS Android phone. I have a OnePlus 7 Pro, previously a Galaxy S5 (the newer Galaxys also work as long as you don't get the US model); it runs LineageOS (stock Android). I chose not to install the Google Play packages. I get apps from F-Droid, which is a repository + package manager that builds and distributes FOSS applications.
It pings time.android.com for NTP, and I think it also uses a Google server to check when you're behind a captive portal WiFi. The default dialer/SMS/Contacts app have some options in the settings that will connect to proprietary APIs; I don't think they talk to Google but if you do then you can replace them with applications from F-Droid. But other than that it's 100% clean.
In the system settings I can completely block applications from using the network. LineageOS also adds Privacy Guard, which lets you deny permissions to applications. I need WhatsApp to communicate with some people, but I have denied it contact permissions so it gets fed an empty address book. I also have it set to require confirmation from me to use the camera or microphone.
I also installed AdAway from F-Droid, which is a DNS-based firewall like Pi-Hole. From F-Droid I also got Firefox with uBlock Origin, K-9 mail client, NewPipe as a YouTube frontent, OsmAnd+ for maps/navigation, DavDroid to sync contacts & calendar with Nextcloud, the Nextcloud Notes app for synced notes, and a OpenVPN client to prevent AT&T from spying on me and injecting tracking identifiers into my internet usage.
The only real threats in the system are the proprietary driver blobs and the risk of Google putting evil code into AOSP instead of limiting it to their proprietary services - but I hope the LineageOS team would be able to catch that.
If you're going to say I can't care about my privacy in relation to Alexa because of some other unrelated privacy concern then yes, it would be a whataboutism and I would call you out on it, as I would in any debate, because that is how civilized discourse works. If you have a genuine, logical argument I'd like to discuss. Unfortunately most people on this site seem to like downvoting relevant points they feel emotional about and arguing without actually making any effort to understand anyone else's point.
shouting "logical fallacy" is not how debate works.
using knowledge of fallacy to illustrate the underlying logical error in someones argument is how debate works. you should never actually need to reference a fallacy out loud during debate.
If there was more to your initial comment I could have said more, but you essentially said 'whatabaout you having a smartphone' and that was it. The sole argument was fallacious, and there was nothing more I could reply to...
I didnt say that. That was someone else. I think everyone else understood the implication of "but you already have a camera and microphone in your pocket, what additional privacy violation does this cause above and beyond everyone's phones." The poster likely thought it didnt need to be spelled out.
> involves charging your accuser with whatever it is you've just been accused of, rather than refuting the truth of the accusation
Thats not what just happened. "You accuser" didnt accuse you of being a privacy violation.
Smart Phone was brought up as an EXAMPLE of having a microphone and camera in your pocket, connected to the internet. It wasnt a change in subject from tracking devices.
>Although you are clearly very confused, because whataboutism is a logical fallacy....
I believe you are the confused one. You changed the subject to a fallacy discussion, by mentioning whataboutism. Its like changing the conversation to fruit by mentioning bananas. Obviously banana is a fruit.
>By carrying a smartphone I'm not allowed to care about my privacy?
to quote you "instead of just in the privacy of my own home." no one said you arent allowed to be concerned about privacy, but thats not what you said. the "hivemind" disagreed with your PREMISE that you arent currently tracked and that this product would suddenly create tracking ability that doesnt already exist. Its the "instead of just in my home" part people are taking issue with, because the "just in my home" reality doesnt exist.
Which literally changes nothing. It's an item on your body with a microphone. So just like your phone, your headphones, etc. It's nothing even particularly new.
Google glass, at least, had a camera that significantly changed the privacy equation. These change nothing.
>backdoor for police into your glasses like they did for amazon ring?
Citation needed, please. To the best of my knowledge there is no back door for police in ring gear. They can request video from users, but there is no requirement it be given up and the request can be denied.
> They can request video from users, but there is no requirement it be given up and the request can be denied.
If you refuse they have a deal with amazon to hand it over to them anyway.
"However, he noted, there is a workaround if a resident happens to reject a police request. If the community member doesn’t want to supply a Ring video that seems vital to a local law enforcement investigation, police can contact Amazon, which will then essentially “subpoena” the video.
“If we ask within 60 days of the recording and as long as it’s been uploaded to the cloud, then Ring can take it out of the cloud and send it to us legally so that we can use it as part of our investigation,” he said."
Police have also shown up at people's doors to intimidate them into handing over videos.
"Police have also told CNET in the past that they've shown up at known Ring users' doorsteps to request footage in person if the online requests don't pan out."
This shouldn't surprise you though. Basically any scrap of data you give to companies like apple google and amazon will be sucked up by the government at some level. Just the other day there was an article about how companies are hit with national security letters forbidding them from saying anything about the data collection going on, but we've known since Snowden's leaks that the NSA was collecting data from those companies already.
>“If we ask within 60 days of the recording and as long as it’s been uploaded to the cloud, then Ring can take it out of the cloud and send it to us legally so that we can use it as part of our investigation,” he said."
Just because someone says something doesn't mean it's true:
>"The reports that police can obtain any video from a Ring doorbell within 60 days is false," a spokesperson said. "Ring will not release customer information in response to government demands without a valid and binding legal demand properly served on us. Ring objects to overbroad or otherwise inappropriate demands as a matter of course. We are working with the Fresno County Sheriff's Office to ensure this is understood."
>"Police have also told CNET in the past that they've shown up at known Ring users' doorsteps to request footage in person if the online requests don't pan out."
This is shitty but not a back door, and it's also something police do if you have regular camera footage they think will help with an investigation too.
So the cop says they get whatever video they want no matter what, but Amazon's PR department says otherwise.
Maybe this was a NSL situation and the cop unintentionally spilled the beans, or maybe it's just weasel words by the amazon PR rep. Technically what they said specifically ("a valid and binding legal demand properly served on us") doesn't necessarily mean anything has to be signed off on by a judge. It just means the police have to make a legal and binding demand which shouldn't be a problem if handing that data over to police whenever they demand it is part of the binding terms of their contract with police.
I'll admit I'm not giving amazon or the police the benefit of the doubt here, but I also have zero reason to.
I think occam's razor here points towards the cop just having no clue how the system works. Amazon explicitly states they'll be reaching out to educate the dude on how it works, lol.
So I can't criticize law enforcement because I'm not a LEO? I can't criticize a politician because I'm not in politics? I can't criticize a woman because I'm not female myself? I can't criticize a parrot owner because I don't own a bird? This is an absolutely ridiculous line of reasoning
>People without children have absolutely no idea what they are talking about and have no means of acquiring that knowledge except by having a child
So a male doctor can't be a gynecologist because they have "no idea what they are talking about and have no means of acquiring that knowledge except by having" female genetalia? I can't have any idea what it's like owning a parrot except by owning a bird? Again, this is absolutely absurd. Having a child does not enter you into some elite class of individuals that no one else can understand, and it's perfectly acceptable for me to criticize you despite not having children myself
In my experience, the least informed always have the strongest opinions. The well informed see all te complexities and know "it's not that easy". Reminds me of this quote:
“The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wise people so full of doubts.”
I genuinely feel bad for your children. You see yourself as somehow metaphysically enlightened and beyond reproach by non-parents, just by virtue of having them - I can't imagine how tyrannical you are in your relationship with them.
By this standard, people who have not had experience or learning in a given domain are just as qualified in that domain as those who have. It is a rejection of all knowledge.
Wow, you sound like a major, self centered narcissist at the very least. There is nothing special about having children, and there is nothing you can learn that I cannot. If you really do have children I feel bad for them. In another comment you said that if I'm really concerned about the environment I should kill myself. You clearly have some issues to work through, and I wish you the best
Personal attacks like this are a bannable offense on HN. Moreover, you got into two of these petty flamewars on HN within 24 hours. That's seriously not ok, and it looks like you've done this in the past as well, so I've banned this account until we get some indication that you want to use HN as intended. If that's the case, you're welcome to email hn@ycombinator.com and say so. We're happy to unban anyone who gives us reason to believe that they'll follow the site guidelines in the future.
Of course anyone can criticize anything they want to. But generally they'll just sound stupid to anyone who actually knows the space. I've never heard a non-parent make a remotely sensible criticism about parenting. I've never heard a non-programmer make a sensible statement about programming, etc. Parents aren't an "elite class of individuals" - we simply have experience non-parents don't. Non-parents talking about parenting are as a rule hilarious examples of the Dunning–Kruger effect. (I'm not a psychologist, so psychologists would probably consider that last statement a hilarious example of the Dunning-Kruger effect :))
While I absolutely agree that there is a ton of bad behavior in the world from people ignorantly pontificating on things outside their wheelhouse, it is incredibly arrogant and ignorant to suggest that non-parents know nothing about parenting. It just doesn't even make logical sense.
If you are constantly late for everything and always blame it on your kid, you are doing something wrong. You should know by now that things always take longer than expected with a kid, and plan accordingly. No, you will not always get it right, and that's fine. Occasional lapses are expected and accepted. But if it becomes a regular pattern, you are simply shifting blame for your poor time-management skills onto a child that does not deserve that finger pointed at them.
If you are going to discount my opinion out of hand, I suppose I can't keep you from doing that. But, my opinion happens to agree with that of a parent upthread, so... take that as you will, I suppose.
> I've never heard a non-parent make a remotely sensible criticism about parenting
Really? What about children of truly abusive parents (who are not themselves parents)? Are their critiques of their parents as parents not remotely sensible?
I'm not at all in favor of people aggressively policing the parenting practices of others. I just don't think Dunning-Kruger applies at all here, because everyone (except orphans) has some significant experience with the practice of parenting - even if it is only as the parented, you can still form cogent opinions about the practice. It's not some high expertise domain like programming, it's literally human nature.
It doesn't even have to be as extreme as abuse. For example, non-parents and parents alike should feel free to be critical of parents who allow their kids to misbehave in a restaurant.
In the rational sense, you have a point. I’m sympathetic to your position. I wish people were better at calmly and dispassionately weighing facts and reason, but we are largely not.
Your male OB example is really close to hitting a subject where people are sometimes angrily and even violently attached to their positions and on which some insist that men do not even have worthwhile opinions — merely because they are men. Similarly, others stake out positions that it is okay to “punch up” because they allege that ethics, propriety, and justice depend on group identity. These are utterly irrational by the same point that I believe you’re making, but knowing your audience is crucial. Good luck being heard on certain subjects.
Parenting isn’t that extreme, but a strong emotional component is present. With criticism in general, if in the audience’s view you haven’t earned the right, then you’re just running your mouth. You may have heard of Powdered Butt Syndrome: anyone who has powdered your butt does not want your opinion on money or sex. Being a parent changes everything in ways that it’s difficult for non-parents to understand. Even if a non-parent accepts this on an intellectual level, the deeper visceral appreciation is still missing.
Yes, being late is rude. Screaming children in a restaurant while others are trying to enjoy a meal is annoying. Parents should not allow their kids to behave like ill-mannered brats. To really oversimplify, becoming a parent tends to raise some parents’ tolerance to misbehavior. I can talk about gross topics over dinner that would have caused my pre-kids self to ask for a change of subject or to excuse myself from the table. Parenting can be exhausting. All relationships are challenging at times. Sometimes people choose to pick their battles.
All that said, some parents dismiss advice or criticism from other parents too. It must be nice to have your perfect kids, live in your perfect neighborhood, and send them to their perfect school. What do you know about my situation? You have X and I don’t. I have Y and you don’t.
Anyone can criticize to criticize. Doing it with love to actually help someone else is much more delicate.
I found that example odd, as in my experience the amount of bars that don't hold your card while a tab is open is in the minority (I don't go to that many, but I actually can't think of any nearby that DON'T take your card). Sometimes I'll just order and close out as soon as I walk in, sometimes I'll hand them my card and close out at the end, but I've never felt that I was being treated like a criminal
I think they mean specifically if the bartender asks you to open your tab before taking your order and/or pouring your drink. For what it's worth I don't think I've ever experienced this, but I could see it being somewhat off-putting.
If you're in a major city it just isn't feasible to purchase a home within walking distance of your business. In the Seattle area, for example, house prices would be easily over a million for anything nearby
In a 5-why's sense it's almost always feasible for you to purchase a home within walking distance of your business, it's just not feasible for everyone to purchase a home within walking distance of their workplace. Home prices are over a million dollars for anything nearby? Get a job that can support a million-dollar home - $1M requires an annual income of about $200K to be affordable, which is easily doable at Google/Amazon/Microsoft/Boeing in the Seattle area. Can't get a job at one of those? Get a job at one of their smaller competitors, become a top contributor, get known in the field, and make some friends who work there. Lack the relevant skillset for that? Learn it - there's a wide open Internet searchable by Google and a lot of textbooks on Amazon where you can teach yourself the sort of theoretical CS that these companies desire. That's only 3 whys. You could also probably have substituted "rent an apartment" instead of "buy a house" and the number of employers that pay you enough to afford it would go up significantly.
A lot of people don't want it that much, and that's fine - that's why not everybody does live within walking distance of their employer. But if you want something enough, there are paths you can take that open up the possibility, you just need to be prepared to sacrifice in other areas.
This is a major oversimplification that is not at all feasible for most people. Sure, I could theoretically get an engineering position at Amazon, buy one of the highly desirable multimillion dollar properties within walking distance that sell before they're even on the market, sell my current house, move my family and possessions, and so on. How reasonable do you think that recommendation really is for most people? Also, this is talking about people running their own businesses, and I certainly don't run Amazon or have the funding to both open my own business anywhere near Seattle as well as purchase a house within walking distance. Sure, you can skew the entire scenario and say it's reasonable to work for a major company as an engineer rather than own your own company, rent an apartment rather than buy a house, and make any number of other changes but that isn't really what is being discussed
Also, talk about putting all your eggs in one basket. Over-extending like that is a good way to become a slave to jobs you actually hate just to afford a lifestyle you forced upon yourself.
Obviously some people thrive in that situation. But sounds naive to not realize how few people can or want to take that gamble.
If you run your own business you often have a much easier pathway to living close to work: move your business. Commercial real estate rents often fall off even faster than residential ones do as you move away from the city center, and the competition from other local businesses tends to thin out. If it's a desirable and affordable place for you to live, it's likely a desirable and affordable place for your customers to live, which makes it an ideal place to situate a local business.
And being flexible with your lifestyle and assumptions so that you can get what you really want in life is exactly what is being discussed here.
That would be nice. Unfortunately, in some areas such as Seattle where I'm currently located, you would have to live hours away from any major cities to find anywhere where you could open a business and purchase a house walking distance from your business without a million plus dollars
Many of the "meal box" companies make the cancellation process very difficult, and it's one of the factors I use when deciding not to do business with a company. However, I agree that I am likely in a very small subset of users, and the vast majority are too lazy or not knowledgeable enough about these tactics to care
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https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20130613/12180423457/if-yo...
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